12 outs: Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI

Bro, does your rig even lift?
CCx266
Met Resolume in a bar the other day
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12 outs: Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI

Post by CCx266 »

Hello all,

[-----------------------------
EDIT: I was first going for '9 outputs with Matrox C900' (first post)
But I moved to 'Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI' following Oaktown's advices. (see my second post)
-----------------------------]

I'm new to this forum but an old user of Arena 4 with no more than 3 screens.
I now have to use 9 displays (projectors) for theater application.
I'm interested in knowing that my configuration can work. I think there is not a lot of users of the Matrox C900 already because it's new and quite rare... But even a theoretical help would be much appreciated.
The Matrox now handle OpenGL® 4.4. I'm just afraid it is not designed for calculation like Arena (that's pretty much where I have no clue).
I'm going to use Resolume 6 and use only the advanced output transformation settings for every output (except monitor screen of course).
I would love to go 1080p30fps on each 9 but I can reduce quality for some of them.
Can someone more experienced than me can tell me if I'm gonna burn the house ? :lol: Here are the specs of my PC:

R81710M - MULTI DISPLAYS SOLUTION (Shuttle XPC)
Windows 10 Pro 64 Bit
Intel Core i7 7700K (4x4.20 GHz)
Windows 10
64 GB DDR4
SSD 500GB 2,5" SATA3
Matrox C900 4GB (9x Mini-HDMI)

Also my question is, how much CPU power do I need ? How much RAM ? I have the budget to go A-Class but maybe is it unnecessary ?
Last edited by CCx266 on Tue Oct 03, 2017 15:04, edited 1 time in total.

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Oaktown
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Re: 9 outputs with Matrox C900 and I7-7700K

Post by Oaktown »

What about your user interface monitor? Are you planning to add a dual or triple head to your C900? I’ve never tested that card but I would think that’s gonna be a huge load for a card that’s not designed for that application.

If you want nine stable 1080P30 outputs, I’m gonna make two recommendations but neither worked well involve your C900 card:

1) If you’ve got the money, buy an Nvidia 1080 TI And three datapath FX4
2) if you’re on a tighter budget, get an Nvidia 1080, one blackmagic decklink quad 2 and one blackmagic decklink duo 2

These options will give you up at least 12 outputs In addition to your user interface which should be more than enough

CCx266
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Re: 9 outputs with Matrox C900 and I7-7700K

Post by CCx266 »

Thank you very much for your reply,
I've been making some more research with the help of your post.
I see your opinion gets along with this PDF:
https://resolume.com/manual/_media/en/r ... upport.pdf

I forgot to say that I didn't buy the PC with the specs of my first post yet anyway. I'm gonna buy everything at once, including Arena 6 licence because it is supposedly working better with multiple cores and stuff... :D

The datapath looks too expensive and your second option is very tempting.
I like HD SDI from experience. Here I will need to install and make it work in one day, that's why I'm really looking for any comments or suggestions.

1) I can use a Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 along with GTX 1080 TI and use all of the outputs of both ?? I need to send a different image to each output, just to be sure :P

2) Can you describe real quick how this will comport in Resolume Arena ? (Like will there be a list of 12 'Display' ?)
The GTX will do the computation for all of these outputs ?
It is a lot of pixels, isn't it (again: playing media and use 'output transformation' on each output only) ?

3) Info greedy questions :mrgreen: ;)
Will I be able to go up to 100m in coax straight out of the blackmagic ?
There is a lot of of GTX 1080 and 1080 TI, does it really matter for performance ? (Also 'Titan Xp')

Thank you again for helping me, it is such an exciting project for me but also swimming in dark water :)

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Oaktown
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Re: 9 outputs with Matrox C900 and I7-7700K

Post by Oaktown »

CCx266 wrote:The datapath looks too expensive and your second option is very tempting.
I know the Datapath is expensive but it's amazing!
1) I can use a Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 along with GTX 1080 TI and use all of the outputs of both ?? I need to send a different image to each output, just to be sure :P
Yes
2) Can you describe real quick how this will comport in Resolume Arena ? (Like will there be a list of 12 'Display' ?)
It'll depend on how things are setup. You will see every physical output connected to the GPU and any available output on the capture card whether or not there is any connected to it.
The GTX will do the computation for all of these outputs ?
That depends on what your composition looks like but chances are the answer is yes.
It is a lot of pixels, isn't it (again: playing media and use 'output transformation' on each output only) ?
What's your comp size?

3) Info greedy questions :mrgreen: ;)
Will I be able to go up to 100m in coax straight out of the blackmagic ?
Yes but 100m is close to the limit so you'll need to buy high quality 75 Ohm Digital Video Coaxial RG-59 Cable that work well for 3G-SDI such as Belden 1694, Belden 1505 or Canare L-4CFB. If you experience issues, you might need to re-clock your digital signal.

As a reminder, digital signals get reclocked ("amped") after the long run.
There is a lot of of GTX 1080 and 1080 TI, does it really matter for performance ? (Also 'Titan Xp')
I tend to only buy Nvidia: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/pr ... x-1080-ti/

Thank you again for helping me, it is such an exciting project for me but also swimming in dark water :)
[/quote]Exciting stuff.....!

CCx266
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Re: 9 outputs with Matrox C900 and I7-7700K

Post by CCx266 »

Thanks, it clears a lot for me :)
Oaktown wrote:I know the Datapath is expensive but it's amazing!
I think I prefer to see every output in resolume for an easier set up (not a big difference I agree)
I like the fact that Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 will output directly in HD SDI to be transformed in HDMI with 100$ adapter from Blackmagic too.
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/produc ... converters
I will only use let's say 60-90m max of 75 Ohm coax (by 30m cables + m/m adapters, high quality. thank for your references !)

For me it looks like this configuration is pretty solid, why would a Datapath be more of a secure option ?
Oaktown wrote:
The GTX will do the computation for all of these outputs ?
That depends on what your composition looks like but chances are the answer is yes.
It is a lot of pixels, isn't it (again: playing media and use 'output transformation' on each output only) ?
What's your comp size?
So, you mean that each Gcard will do the work for its own outputs that I select in Resolume ? If Blackmagic can't do the maths, I'm pretty screwed :|
I will ease the process as possible and use 1920*1080 media (if that's what you mean by comp size ?) for same output definition with output transformation. I will loose a bit of quality but it's okay. I will try to find the best encapsulation method to lighten the process (RAW video, AVI,...)

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Oaktown
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Re: 12 outs: Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI

Post by Oaktown »

I will only use let's say 60-90m max of 75 Ohm coax (by 30m cables + m/m adapters, high quality. thank for your references !)
My recommendation is to avoid m/m adapters and use one cable for each home run instead but if you use high end cables, your proposed setup might work no problems.
I think I prefer to see every output in resolume for an easier set up (not a big difference I agree)
You don't need to see what's not there, right? The big difference is that the GPU will only show outputs that have an EDID connected to them where as the decklink will always show up either way.
I like the fact that Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 will output directly in HD SDI to be transformed in HDMI with 100$ adapter from Blackmagic too.
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/produc ... converters
I use these all the time and they work great but you might want to look at the new Decimator MD-LX
For me it looks like this configuration is pretty solid, why would a Datapath be more of a secure option ?
The Datapath FX4 offers a lot more options. You might want to test HD-SDI outputs before you commit to it.
So, you mean that each Gcard will do the work for its own outputs that I select in Resolume ? If Blackmagic can't do the maths, I'm pretty screwed :|
No, the primary GPU will do all the calculations.
I will ease the process as possible and use 1920*1080 media (if that's what you mean by comp size ?) for same output definition with output transformation. I will loose a bit of quality but it's okay. I will try to find the best encapsulation method to lighten the process (RAW video, AVI,...)
The question is what will be the overall size of your comp. There are many options on how you could approach this, ranging from a comp that's pixel per pixel (22,809,600 pixels total) or one that 1920x1080 (2,073,600 pixels total) with 11 layers each directed to a different output.

As a note, the maximum size is 16384 pixels in either directions so you could make a comp that 11 @ 1920x1080 screens wide but you could make the comp 11,520x2160

CCx266
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Re: 12 outs: Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI

Post by CCx266 »

The big difference is that the GPU will only show outputs that have an EDID connected to them where as the decklink will always show up either way.
I understand it is a big advantage especially when you power off projectors (or a quick disconnection :o ), for exemple. But for 1000$ each box + extra configuring + extending signal to projectors via rj-45, etc... I prefer to leave everything turned on and make my cabling safe :)
The Datapath FX4 offers a lot more options. You might want to test HD-SDI outputs before you commit to it.
I won't have the real field experience before buying ;) But I use to work a lot with HD-SDI and I was always satisfied. So I will cross my fingers (oops all fingers are already crossed :D )
The question is what will be the overall size of your comp. There are many options on how you could approach this, ranging from a comp that's pixel per pixel (22,809,600 pixels total) or one that 1920x1080 (2,073,600 pixels total) with 11 layers each directed to a different output.
As a note, the maximum size is 16384 pixels in either directions so you could make a comp that 11 @ 1920x1080 screens wide but you could make the comp 11,520x2160
Very interesting info, I didn't have the chance to experiment the limitations of Arena (and memory allocation, I guess). Either way it will be okay for me, maybe 1*(3840 × 2160) and 8*(1920 x 1080). Also I have the possibility to drop down resolution for some of the projectors if necessary.

I feel more confident thanks to you ! For info the show will not happen until summer 2018 in Paris and I'll post when I get to test it.

courtyardstudio
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Re: 12 outs: Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI

Post by courtyardstudio »

Hi CCx266,
I am very interested to know how you got on with your Decklink Quad 2 setup.
I too am planning for a project with that will require multiple independant video outs - could be 20+.
I'm thinking that a workstation with one Decklink Quad 2 will be a good starting point, and once I get this working satisfactorily, then perhaps duplicate the workstation setup with a 2nd unit...

As I am new to Resolume, presumably with a Decklink Quad 2 on board, I just stack eight videos (1920x1080@25fps) in eight layers and then in the Advanced Output settings, direct Resolume to send a full screen slice from each individual layer to each of the eight individual outputs (which presumably are just an extended desktop?).

So I get eight full-screen 1080 videos on eight screens/monitors - all independently controllable.
Is this correct?

Is it feasible to have two Decklink Quad 2 cards in the one Workstation to give in 16 independant outputs from one unit?
Has anyone successful done this?
And if so, what is the required hardware configuration?
Many thanks for any feedback or direction.

CCx266
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Re: 12 outs: Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI

Post by CCx266 »

Hey courtyardstudio,
I didn't buy the Quad 2 yet, this is still my plan....

However, I'm trying the possibilities of using a dozen of raspberry pi, each of them connected to video projectors.
I need to be able to remotely (from one computer) control a basic mapping and sync all of them.
It's waaaaaay more geeky but would be very expandable to any configuration like yours or any else.

For your questions, Oaktown said that there is a limit (pixel number) of around 11 x 1920*1080 per composition (project).
In theory, two Quad 2 could work together. For my project even if I don't use many effects I though it was safer to have a Nvidia GTX 1080 that can do the hard work of calculation but maybe it's not necessary.

And yes Resolume works like this, you can have many layers and you choose which one goes to which screen and how.

Cheers for 2018 :mrgreen:

admiralperpetual
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Re: 12 outs: Blackmagic Decklink Quad 2 + GTX 1080 TI

Post by admiralperpetual »

hey we have several systems using the decklink quad 2 cards now and they are quite nice. frame rate (in resolume 5 anyway) can take quite a hit, but 12 outs shouldn't be too hard - we have one system with 3x of the cards for example which struggles sometimes but hoping v6 will help a bit ;)

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