Cable length in Installations DVI-D / HDMI (Datapath X4)

[OdyPody]

Hello Folks!

Setup: 4 Projectors FHD at 1 Datapath X4

I have a calculated cable length around 20 meters from the Datapath to the projector which is the furthest away.

From Specs what i know is that DVI Cable length is not recommended further away then 5 Meters. as the Datapath only has DVI-D Outputs how can i reach the distance the best way?

Is it enough to use an adapter DVI-D to HDMI and run an active fiber HDMI Cable?

will a active HDMI Cable not work cause of the adapter?

Do i need an active Konverter DVI to HDMI first? (if so any recommendations?)

or that is all wrong and the "right way" to do it is totally different...

Sorry for my incompetence. I have been a lightdesigner the last 10 years but only worked with DMX and Artnet and Pixelmapping. Video is still all new to me.

Thanks for help.

[Scratchpole]

You should be good with DVI-D to HDMI plus an active fiber HDMI Cable, but there's a chance the fibre could introduce a small lag (important if spanning/blending content), use the same on all outputs if possible.
You may also get away with a standard high grade HDMI cable, I've used 20m previously.
I'd hope you'll be able to test your set-up days before going to the venue in order to give yourself time to iron out any issues especially if you have not used an x4 previously.

[OdyPody]

Well the idea is to always use exactly the same Setup to Tour on small Private Events on one side or i do fixed installations that will stay more or less forever.

I have all possibilities to Test. Just wanted to hear some Experienced Info before to decide what i will test exactly.

Thanks for sharing yours.

The info with the lag could be a decicive one as i mainly use mapping with DJ live controling the Video with a Denon Setup so lag is an enemy. i hope its not more then 0.05 Seconds as if so i could go with an wireless solution and would be even faster then with the cable. I basically wanted to use cables to avoid any latency.
So i have some things to test out.

[Scratchpole]

Don't even dream of using wireless. A good fibre system would be measured in lines of delay not even frames.

[Arvol]

What PJ's are you using? An Ideal setup would be a single HDMI from your computer into a SDI flavour of a FX4. Then use some quality 6G SDI cable from Canare to send the FX4 to each PJ (which hopefully has a 3G SDI input built into it, or has a 3G SDI input option card). This will keep all 4 PJ's in sync without the need for additional converters. If your PJ's also have a Genlock sync port, then you could also run some 6G SDI cable to a sync generator as an additional step, but probably isn't required.

Otherwise give these a shot and keep your fingers crossed.
https://www.amazon.com/Fiber-Optic-HDMI ... B07NMZSHX6
https://www.amazon.com/Benfei-Bidirecti ... R45X9?th=1
https://www.amazon.com/Anker-Charge-Cha ... B01IUTIUEA
^Cable direction DOES matter.
If this is for a shows vs install's just add in an additional $200 per show to your invoice for replacing Fiber as needed.

You could also grab some Tac-Fiber and these:
https://www.amazon.com/Over-Singlemode- ... B0821V4926
to use alongside this:
https://www.amazon.com/AJA-HA5-4K-HDMI- ... B00WNDSQ4O
but if you already have the X4, then I would just stick with that system.

On a side note, do you need a spare X4? LMK, Got one that's just collecting dust.

[OdyPody]

Thanks for the links and infos.

I have one of these cables to try:

https://www.thomann.de/es/pro_snake_aoc ... _a_25m.htm

I have one 10K Ansi Projector with SDI but its big and heavy.

The idea for the private events is to go with 5-8 reall small laser projectors 1500 Ansi is more then enough as its only night use and the mapping has 90% an ambient function.

Im thinking about JMGO N1 projectors. as the Design of the projector itself is also appealing and i like the gimbal. image quality is great. ticks nearly all boxes. just i would liekd ot have a shorter throw.

https://global.jmgo.com/products/jmgo-n1

the idea then is to make custom stands and you can put them at a venue anywhere in a garden or around a pool and mapp on anything.

in my ideal fantasy i run all projectors with powerbanks and the signals are all wireless.

i will report my succes or the opposite as well....

Ah and the sidenote: About the X4 - i just bought a second for 200 bucks as backup. what you want to have for yours? maybe i can think about a 3rd one - you never know. Is it the Rack Version or the smaller box?

[Arvol]

It's the small box version. Yeah $200 would be about what I'm asking as well.



If these where standalone screens and tearing wasn't an issue, the following could be a fun setup.

Communication:
When AP's are within 1,000' (300m): https://www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti-Long-R ... B08V1PF29L
When AP's are further apart: https://www.amazon.com/UBIQUITI-NBE-5AC ... B072RSF5XW

Power:
https://www.amazon.com/iCreatin-Gigabit ... 37HDS?th=1

Signal:
https://www.amazon.com/Zowietek-Convert ... B0CGRZ9DQ2

I've use this method for NDI Camera's for a year now and it works great.
I haven't tested the NDI Transcoder yet but it's scheduled to be delivered in a few weeks. (I do have the Science Image flavor and it works great, just 10x's the price).

NDI HX3 has 1.5 frames of latency, NDI HB has 1 frame.

Just plug in your power, aim your AP's (if needed) and output everything via NDI.

[OdyPody]

That NDI Stuff looks interesting.

So in theory i need 2 converters per Signal Chain: Grafikcard > DPX4 > DVI/HDMI Adapter > Converter HDMI-NDI > Wireless Router > Acces Point > Converter NDI-HDMI > Projector.

is that correct? pricing would be pretty fair if we can get less then 10ms total delay.

I cant imagine a situation where the distance is further then 100m

Would be intersting what latency the whole chain finally creates.

[Arvol]

For NDI it would be:
Create a screen/output in Resolume Arena and send that screen out NDI (no outputs via GPU other than the UI). Grab an 8-12 port POE+ 1-10G network switch ($150-500)
Run some cat6 cable, a box of solid copper core (not that copper clad aluminum crap [CCA]) 1000' costs about $150
Grab some of those cheap NDI Transcoders and a HDMI cable and program the devices to listen to a certain NDI stream from Resolume.
Connect output HDMI and you're done.

Funny enough, that NDI box actually came in yesterday (it showed mid Dec. but whatev)
The thing works pretty damn good for being less than $150.....

A few notes:
It does 1080p@60 (3G), but only does 4K@30 (6G) so if you need 4K@60 (12G) this is not the device for you. (Maybe they will have a 12G option soon?)

The device never would assign it's own failsafe IP for initial programming so have a router nearby for ease of setup.

When set to NDI HX3 I was getting between 150-200ms of latency from source to receiver. By standards NDI HX3 is supposed to be less than 100ms, so I'm almost twice the latency of what is to be expected with NDI HX3. But even at 200ms (0.2 seconds or less than 1/4 of a second) I'm not complaining for $111. All in all, not a bad box for under $150. I haven't stress test it yet so I don't have an opinion on longevity and stability yet.

[OdyPody]

Thanks for the details and the in depth concept.

I need to see how my wireless will work out as the transmitters i will use have a real word latency of 0,12 S which would be faster then ur system and they cost even less.

But i dont have them yet. i will report the result will be middle to end December probably.